what about archers ubalanced

[ExtraOrdinary]

Dunno how you get 230 ac, using candles? cant use more than ds shield. Archers do use many rare like Desire Force Distant to kill priest. You can ask Torment or BBkill those are the main d4 archers of this server. Ask them if can kill any1 or not. They always play stroke candles so smart useless against them; double extreme can kill easily any1.
Give me the name of those D3 priest who survive in a single duel with Torment or BBkill. My priest got G20 AC and they deal 3.5k dmg over my sfd. You talking as if an archer should exist to kill priest. This game was designed to have a balance between different classes and if theres some class that is weak in something for sure are stronger at other stuff.
And with my suggestion I ddnt turn archers into thief with red cs effects, i was talking about a change that dont make them SO DAMN WEAK against wizards, and thats the most important thing since wizards are main killers of archers.



I never had a priest called padrecolomax =_= btw dont want go offtopic same as Eleval.

[Titus]

Agree with colo when he say that archers main problem is that they die very fast.In my opinion the Second archers problem is that they cant kill other clases in pvp. Thats why archers are not playing to much on this days...

Soooo archers should live more and kill more. Its so hard code this?

[ExtraOrdinary]

if they can stand alive little more in pvp, for sure gonna have the possibility of killing more people. so my suggestion could be taken as an example of how change archers skills, and seems that Thomas proposed something like this before, as he said.

[GMTempest]

Agree with colo when he say that archers main problem is that they die very fast.In my opinion the Second archers problem is that they cant kill other clases in pvp. Thats why archers are not playing to much on this days...

Soooo archers should live more and kill more. Its so hard code this?

Not hard to code but it is for the following reasons:
-As someone already pointed out, giving archers more survivability practically makes them no difference than a thief. You give them survivability on par with thief+ice shield, and they're literally a second thief minus the option of pepsi. You give them more defense than thief and then why go thief. Basically, we don't want two of the same class.
-Archers have and always been the dangerous class. Up close multi spam is consistently one of the highest DPS in the game, archers needed to kill their opponent before their opponent kills them. The trade off however, drops off end game where they usually find themselves dead before their opponents are dead, resulting to more hit and run tactics. We would like to improve this part of the archers.

Further, there is a lot of discussion on balance. Look at it this way, if the total AC drop was 1, it would be underpowered. If the total AC drop was 200, it would be overpowered. What does this mean? It means somewhere along the lines, there a balance point. We will find that point. Do not assume it will be under or overpowered.

Next, limited counters does exist:
In 1V1, it could take time to get all 5 debuffs on one target. The opponent can take this time to take advantage of the archers lack of defenses and kill them first before the archer begins their attack.
In mass PK, as said, the archer requires focus. Kill them first. Hide behind someone and reset the debuff. Avoid the archer/dodge his debuff attacks.

Further, while there is no remove to it, it does not automatically make it overpowered. While most things in DR is removable, adding something that isn't won't break the balance as long as we keep tweaking it to the perfect spot. If it is still overpowering on release, it's all too likely we will add a true counter to it.

[ExtraOrdinary]

seems that GMTeam thinking seriously on apply this crap :S, dont feel as an offense I really dont like it. And I do believe archers wont be like thieves on this point =_= they still no parry and it count alot in pk..

[Ipwn_]

Agree with colo when he say that archers main problem is that they die very fast.In my opinion the Second archers problem is that they cant kill other clases in pvp. Thats why archers are not playing to much on this days...

Soooo archers should live more and kill more. Its so hard code this?

Not hard to code but it is for the following reasons:
-As someone already pointed out, giving archers more survivability practically makes them no difference than a thief. You give them survivability on par with thief+ice shield, and they're literally a second thief minus the option of pepsi. You give them more defense than thief and then why go thief. Basically, we don't want two of the same class.
-Archers have and always been the dangerous class. Up close multi spam is consistently one of the highest DPS in the game, archers needed to kill their opponent before their opponent kills them. The trade off however, drops off end game where they usually find themselves dead before their opponents are dead, resulting to more hit and run tactics. We would like to improve this part of the archers.

Further, there is a lot of discussion on balance. Look at it this way, if the total AC drop was 1, it would be underpowered. If the total AC drop was 200, it would be overpowered. What does this mean? It means somewhere along the lines, there a balance point. We will find that point. Do not assume it will be under or overpowered.

Next, limited counters does exist:
In 1V1, it could take time to get all 5 debuffs on one target. The opponent can take this time to take advantage of the archers lack of defenses and kill them first before the archer begins their attack.
In mass PK, as said, the archer requires focus. Kill them first. Hide behind someone and reset the debuff. Avoid the archer/dodge his debuff attacks.

Further, while there is no remove to it, it does not automatically make it overpowered. While most things in DR is removable, adding something that isn't won't break the balance as long as we keep tweaking it to the perfect spot. If it is still overpowering on release, it's all too likely we will add a true counter to it.

Just a quick question about this buff for archers, would the skill work on stones as well? That'd kinda make the skill really op in my oppinion

[GMSignPainter]

Of course it won't work on stones.
As most curses it won't work on monsters > lvl 100 and on special NPCs like Stones.

[pepex]

Not hard to code but it is for the following reasons:
-As someone already pointed out, giving archers more survivability practically makes them no difference than a thief. You give them survivability on par with thief+ice shield, and they're literally a second thief minus the option of pepsi. You give them more defense than thief and then why go thief. Basically, we don't want two of the same class.
-Archers have and always been the dangerous class. Up close multi spam is consistently one of the highest DPS in the game, archers needed to kill their opponent before their opponent kills them. The trade off however, drops off end game where they usually find themselves dead before their opponents are dead, resulting to more hit and run tactics. We would like to improve this part of the archers.

Further, there is a lot of discussion on balance. Look at it this way, if the total AC drop was 1, it would be underpowered. If the total AC drop was 200, it would be overpowered. What does this mean? It means somewhere along the lines, there a balance point. We will find that point. Do not assume it will be under or overpowered.

Next, limited counters does exist:
In 1V1, it could take time to get all 5 debuffs on one target. The opponent can take this time to take advantage of the archers lack of defenses and kill them first before the archer begins their attack.
In mass PK, as said, the archer requires focus. Kill them first. Hide behind someone and reset the debuff. Avoid the archer/dodge his debuff attacks.

Further, while there is no remove to it, it does not automatically make it overpowered. While most things in DR is removable, adding something that isn't won't break the balance as long as we keep tweaking it to the perfect spot. If it is still overpowering on release, it's all too likely we will add a true counter to it.

i think the problem is beyond the archer class, the game has become an AC fest specialy white AC, as many have pointed before not using shield is a huge drawback that no one whants.


asuming what i said above is true the problem is that def build (1h + shield) are more effetive than 2h builds wich is shown by the fact that most builds are 1h + shield.

the solution not to only fix archer but all 2h builds would be to give them a stronger niche in the game, my best bet would be to reduce 1h weapons damage, that way 2h will have an increase of survival against 1h as well as their own niche as high damage dealer, same could be applied to priest and wiz they should lose some offensive powers that could be regain when using staffs.

[ExtraOrdinary]

not going to happend, damage of one handed weapons isnt the problem. I see Archers complaining because they cant combine skills and plus getting raped alot by wizards when massive pk starts. I cant find anything wrong on giving them the possibility of having a Fire Shield similar as Thieves Ice Shield. Obviously it woulnt the same as thief because they got less AC, but to give Archers a little change against dieing againt wizards I suggested something as:

Magical protection shield (20% def against magics)+ Multiple fire
or
Melee protection shield (30% same as Wiz protection) + Extreme fire

If this is success you are giving the perfect balance to archer class without mess with the balance of different classes. Obviously this suggestion is just that, a suggestion, but thinking as player ingame and thinking as Archer player I find this really good.
And as I repeat, Archers got more power to kill than thiefs, but at same time they got raped really easily and I do think with my suggestion they can survive little more without mess with the game balance.
This can be changed its just a suggestion you can modify and suggest other changes but the idea isnt bad.

[Eleval]

Ermmm, you know that not only wizards can rape Archers easily?
To be honest the worse ennemy of the Archer is the Fencing warrior which can rape an archer in only one or two hits of Sword 'n rose.
Also, thieves can blue archers and kill them in a few seconds only.
And that Fire Shield won't protect from curses I guess, making the archer getting stunned and killed in a few seconds.
So imo => Bad Suggestion.
Plus if you read other topics about this, archer players want a support skill like the thieves got pepsi. A tweak on converting armor does it perfectly.
Imo as I already said, you are just mad because priests will be less unkillable. (Doesn't surprise me from a priest player)