Lightning Shield / Ice Armor

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Metalarg
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Joined: Tue Nov 10, 2015 8:25 pm

Re: Lightning Shield / Ice Armor

Postby Metalarg » Fri Jun 03, 2016 3:40 pm

i can saw a point about the curses in Dragon Raja, its the only game that curses effect last so long, and maybe thats a good point to change.

most popular games Curses last 4 to 5 seconds, (perfect time with team work to kill someone or shut down them) here on Dragon Raja one stun or stone could last more than 3 minutes...

to be honest with all of yours, curse time in this game its ridiculous... extremely long.

thats why i am agree with those counter measures

in the end and like things are going for now, 2 of 3 or 1 of 2 person that goes a maze are priest.

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SimpleStupid
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Re: Lightning Shield / Ice Armor

Postby SimpleStupid » Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:39 pm

I feel the same way as curses in this game are OP, not only blind stun, but also pepsi. On the another hand, is there any counter play for it? Yes, counterreturn, invalid curse, languid, enlight, protection, nazi, bless, blablabla
Does this benifit for certain players? No, you choose your class as in a team, which is filled with rule players.
Take invalid curse as an example, if you can not find a buff in 30s, your team probably need to run more casters, and its not my fault your casters dont care on support.
顺风速上可装逼,逆风回城可挂机 8-)

ArabianArrow
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Re: Lightning Shield / Ice Armor

Postby ArabianArrow » Fri Jun 03, 2016 5:41 pm

SimpleStupid wrote:I feel the same way as curses in this game are OP, not only blind stun, but also pepsi.


Of course it's OP. Curses in this game have always been broken. Look at defood; a skill that was so bad that it got removed completely instead of being nerfed. If it's OP then it should be balanced. It's simply stupid.

This isn't even a support role, this is a life support role ^_^

A person shouldn't be entirely reliant on another person. Here's an example to illustrate how me and other modern games draw the line between balanced and poorly designed support roles:

Scenario 1:

Warrior: "They put a 50% AC reduction on me, I NEED REMOVE CURSE"

Now here, the player can still PLAY the game. He just has a disadvantage over the enemies, BUT IT'S STILL PLAYABLE. He's not completely reliant on another person.

Scenario 2 (DR):

Warrior: "They stoned/stunned/blinded me, I NEED REMOVE CURSE"

Now here, the game is unplayable at this point. He can't play the game until someone helps him out of this OP curse. And to be entirely dependent on another player to play the game is a poor model for any game out there. Some of you may think the game is still playable with blind, it's really not :?. Clicking on the dark areas (99% of your screen :D ) won't move your char. You have to click at your feet to move consistently.
FUNFUNFUN
Image

If you're reading this and can't tell the difference between scenarios 1 & 2, god bless your soul.

Conclusion: Scenario 1 still requires a support role to win battles. I am going to guess that fixing this poorly design curse system was the GM's intention with these changes, and I applaud them for it, but I think they approached it the wrong way.

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proeel
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Re: Lightning Shield / Ice Armor

Postby proeel » Fri Jun 03, 2016 5:42 pm

Curse is not something NOT not-preventable.

A simple pro can fix all the problem. Why is this even an issue that concerning an update?

You guys really think this particular update will not cause more unbalance?

I wonder who's idea is it....


---------------------------------------------------



I have said many time, if you are not happy about whoever's input, feel free to move on.
No need to make the replies longer and longer and to be honest, you are not the gate keeper of the beta forum or whatever.
GM will do the judgement.

Chill kido.

8997840-Yellow-road-sign-graphic-with-arrow-pointing-down-Stock-Photo-arrow.jpg
Last edited by proeel on Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:26 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Happy Gaming xD

Metalarg
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Re: Lightning Shield / Ice Armor

Postby Metalarg » Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:05 pm

all curses in this game have they counter measures, yes, but well lighting shield/icing armor could be a very efficient resourse to add, in the end we are going to continue use proc, sfd, or anti curse buff.

its my thought, was tested ingame where that buff was implemented.

well dont gona to reply since we are talking from 2 differents sides

one side of us talk using their imagination to show how things "COULD" change (if you read all post you its very easy to identify those lazys)

the other side go and test in beta to give a feedback. :roll:

for the facts that we can analize here, some only read and imagine that their gameplay could be nerfed, and well start to cry here, without knowing how it works propetly, and theres only one way to get it, its GOING TO BETA, TEST WHAT HAPPEND, and then come talk here!
Last edited by Metalarg on Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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SimpleStupid
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Re: Lightning Shield / Ice Armor

Postby SimpleStupid » Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:10 pm

SimpleStupid wrote:I feel the same way as curses in this game are OP, not only blind stun, but also pepsi. On the another hand, is there any counter play for it? Yes, counterreturn, invalid curse, languid, enlight, protection, nazi, bless, blablabla
Does this benifit for certain players? No, you choose your class as in a team, which is filled with rule players.
Take invalid curse as an example, if you can not find a buff in 30s, your team probably need to run more casters, and its not my fault your casters dont care on support.
顺风速上可装逼,逆风回城可挂机 8-)

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bminickw
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Re: Lightning Shield / Ice Armor

Postby bminickw » Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:27 pm

proeel wrote:Curse is not something NOT not-preventable.

A simple pro can fix all the problem. Why is this even an issue that concerning an update?

You guys really think this particular update will not cause more unbalance?

I wonder who's idea is it....


So now we HAVE to have a mage to be full-time support? '-_-
Now the game requires class stacking to be played properly? '-_-

Nothing in this game was ever unpreventable. I'm sure I missed a couple on this list that was ultimately changed/removed.

Here are some examples:
:arrow: Pepsi (Nerfed) <--- This wasn't unpreventable either, but was still nerfed. (Speed Potions)
:arrow: Defood (Nerfed) <--- This wasn't unpreventable either, but was still removed. (Burgers, Etc.)
:arrow: Complete Sanctuary (Removed) <--- This wasn't unpreventable either, but was still removed. (Pierce Lightning, and Arrow)
:arrow: Stealing (Removed) <--- This wasn't unpreventable either, but was still removed. (Traps)
:arrow: Snooping (Removed)

To get back on topic. I think the change to lightning shield and ice armor is NOT the correct way to go. However, I am looking for more discussion on duration of curses. Could these be lowered to help balance things a little more? I think you guys are getting caught up on the argument about lightning shield and ice armor. Let's move the discussion towards curses in general. How could the GMs balance this issue. We all know the curses are OP (I think we all agree) What is the solution?

This is BETA for a reason. Let's take our personal feelings towards each other away from these discussions. If you simply don't agree with it, state your reason why, and move on. If someone replies with a constructive criticism, then reply. The more we turn this into emotional / personal gains, the less effective BETA testing will be.
Streaming Dragon Raja Gameplay -- https://www.twitch.tv/bminickwtv

ArabianArrow
Posts: 2016
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Re: Lightning Shield / Ice Armor

Postby ArabianArrow » Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:48 pm

It's kind of hard having a constructive discussion when people reply with their own quotes or call you a kiddo.

You can either agree with someone, or disagree AND provide counters to their reasoning like bminickw just did.

I feel like a lot of times people are debating with each other even when they are in agreement. Maybe we really do need a forum gate keeper :W:

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SimpleStupid
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Re: Lightning Shield / Ice Armor

Postby SimpleStupid » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:27 pm

The reason I quoted my last posts is no one really answered it, instead of making pointless posts over and over. Im willing to discuss the gaming balance in terms of both class and nation, long as its health for the server, and fun to play.

About how to counter curses, like Ed said many times and no one really give much discuss on it. They are really basic counter plays, why dont do it? The new updates for warrior and archer stun is true nightmare, which piercing shieldings. Support mage is not new, I been playing this way for a long time, and its an effective way to help my team to compete. Killing no longer is a priority on my list, buff>curse>kill. Even many people saying curse is OP, but the majority of team fight is still based on warrior and priest, what a sad game.
顺风速上可装逼,逆风回城可挂机 8-)

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SimpleStupid
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Re: Lightning Shield / Ice Armor

Postby SimpleStupid » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:34 pm

As kleis feedback, Id see theres a gap between the negitive play and the competive play. Defood is definitely a negitive play, same goes for steals, its just not fun at all. If you say oh shit I cant find a buff for blind/stun, this is just bad.
顺风速上可装逼,逆风回城可挂机 8-)


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