Dual Class Symbols

[Elmy]

Let's make them not suck. Every dual should be considered by the player. It shouldn't be hands down between 2, and in some cases only 1.

Another note is that upgrading the dual symbols are a pain. Sure they are a good benefit - but why not make them a great benefit? This will also give people more leeway when making rares, and we might see some new developments in end-game PVP as a result.

My main point here is to make every dual symbol valid (or worth getting). A suggestion that branches off of that one is to change to level of Grade for the symbols. For example, AC symbol provides G7.5 AC. MV symbol provides G4 MV. But both symbols have a maximum of G20. So why does AC provide more? Let's make all rare-type symbols that have a max of G20 give G7.5 at level 4. And all rare-type symbols that have a max of G10 (Smart, ACC, etc) a max of G4 at level 4. Before you say "Well it's not fair if two of them give G7.5's and then another symbol only gives two G4's or one G4 and one G7.5." Think about it for a minute and realize that this isn't necessarily true.

Now, for the main part of this. Making each symbol worth it. I'm posting each dual class and symbols which I feel should be associated with that dual. I will only keep the original symbol if it's actually worth a shit. Otherwise, each set is a proposition for that dual that I feel would put it on par with the others.


WARRIOR:

Lord Knight: AC (7.5) / ACC (4) --- AC (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- ACC (4) / FORCE (7.5)

SwashBuckler: MOVE SPEED (7.5) / ACC (4) --- MOVE SPEED (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- MOVE SPEED (7.5) / AC (7.5)

WarMaster: SMART (4) / MOVE SPEED (7.5) --- SMART (4) / FORCE (7.5) --- SMART (4) / AC (7.5)

Blade Singer: EVASION (4) / AC (7.5) --- EVASION (4) / FORCE (7.5) --- EVASION (4) / ACC (4)

Paladin: RESIST (7.5) / AC (7.5) --- RESIST (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- RESIST (7.5) / ACC (4)


THIEF:

Corsair: AC (7.5) / ACC (4) --- AC (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- AC (7.5) / DISTANCE (7.5)

Nighthawk: SMART (4) / ACC (4) --- SMART (4) / FORCE (7.5) --- ACC (4) / DISTANCE (7.5)

Vigilante: DISTANCE (7.5) / FORCE (7.5)

Toreador: EVASION (4) / LONG DISTANCE (7.5) --- EVASION (4) / FORCE (7.5) --- EVASION (4) / ACC (4)

Revenant: RESIST (7.5) / LONG DISTANCE (7.5) --- RESIST (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- RESIST (7.5) / ACC (4)


ARCHER:

Conqueror: AC (7.5) / ACC (4) --- AC (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- ACC (4) / FORCE (7.5)

Desperado: FORCE (7.5) / AC (7.5) --- FORCE (7.5) / MOVE SPEED (7.5) --- ACC (4) / MOVE SPEED (7.5)

Hawkeye: SMART (4) / ACC (4) --- FORCE (7.5) / DISTANCE (7.5) --- FORCE (7.5) / ACC (4)

TriggerMage: EVASION (4) / ACC (4) --- EVASION (4) / FORCE (7.5)

WarSaint: RESIST (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- RESIST (7.5) / ACC (4)


WIZARD:

Warlock: AC (7.5) / SMART (4) --- AC (7.5) / +HP (7.5)

Tzigane: MOVE SPEED (7.5) / SMART (4) --- MOVE SPEED (7.5) / MV (7.5) --- SMART (4) / MV (7.5)

ArchMage: MOVE SPEED (7.5) / BR (4) --- SMART (4) / BR (4)

Grand Wizard: MV (7.5) / BR (4)


PRIEST:

Templar: AC (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- AC (7.5) / AID (7.5) --- AC (7.5) / MASKING (7.5)

Fallen: MOVE SPEED (7.5) / AC (7.5) --- MOVE SPEED (7.5) / WISE (4)

Avenger: MOVE SPEED (7.5) / SMART (4) --- MOVE SPEED (7.5) / WISE (4)

Saint: WISE (4) / AC (7.5) --- WISE (4) / STRIKE (4) --- WISE (4) / COUNTER (4)

[tsleeaa]

Let's make them not suck. Every dual should be considered by the player. It shouldn't be hands down between 2, and in some cases only 1.

Another note is that upgrading the dual symbols are a pain. Sure they are a good benefit - but why not make them a great benefit? This will also give people more leeway when making rares, and we might see some new developments in end-game PVP as a result.

My main point here is to make every dual symbol valid (or worth getting). A suggestion that branches off of that one is to change to level of Grade for the symbols. For example, AC symbol provides G7.5 AC. ACC symbol provides G4 ACC. But both symbols have a maximum of G20. So why does AC provide more? Let's make all rare-type symbols that have a max of G20 give G7.5 at level 4. And all rare-type symbols that have a max of G10 (Smart, ACC, etc) a max of G4 at level 4. Before you say "Well it's not fair if two of them give G7.5's and then another symbol only gives two G4's or one G4 and one G7.5." That about it for a minute and realize that this isn't necessarily true.

Now, for the main part of this. Making each symbol worth it. I'm posting each dual class and symbols which I feel should be associated with that dual. I will only keep the original symbol if it's actually worth a shit. Otherwise, each set is a proposition for that dual that I feel would put it on par with the others.


WARRIOR:

Lord Knight: AC (7.5) / ACC (4) --- AC (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- ACC (4) / FORCE (7.5)

SwashBuckler: MOVE SPEED (7.5) / ACC (4) --- MOVE SPEED (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- MOVE SPEED (7.5) / AC (7.5)

WarMaster: SMART (4) / MOVE SPEED (7.5) --- SMART (4) / FORCE (7.5) --- SMART (4) / AC (7.5)

Blade Singer: EVASION (4) / AC (7.5) --- EVASION (4) / FORCE (7.5) --- EVASION (4) / ACC (4)

Paladin: RESIST (7.5) / AC (7.5) --- RESIST (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- RESIST (7.5) / ACC (4)


THIEF:

Corsair: AC (7.5) / ACC (4) --- AC (7.5) / FORCE (7.5)

Nighthawk: SMART (4) / ACC (4) --- SMART (4) / FORCE (7.5)

Vigilante: DISTANCE (7.5) / FORCE (7.5)

Toreador: EVASION (4) / LONG DISTANCE (7.5) --- EVASION (4) / FORCE (7.5) --- EVASION (4) / ACC (4)

Revenant: RESIST (7.5) / LONG DISTANCE (7.5) --- RESIST (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- RESIST (7.5) / ACC (4)


ARCHER:

Conqueror: AC (7.5) / ACC (4) --- AC (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- ACC (4) / FORCE (7.5)

Desperado: FORCE (7.5) / AC (7.5) --- FORCE (7.5) / MOVE SPEED (7.5) --- ACC (4) / MOVE SPEED (7.5)

Hawkeye: SMART (4) / ACC (4) --- FORCE (7.5) / DISTANCE (7.5) OR FORCE (7.5) / ACC (4)

TriggerMage: EVASION (4) / ACC (4) --- EVASION (4) / FORCE (7.5)

WarSaint: RESIST (7.5) / FORCE (7.5) --- RESIST (7.5) / ACC (4)


WIZARD:

Warlock: AC (7.5) / SMART (4) --- AC (7.5) / +HP (7.5)

Tzigane: MOVE SPEED (7.5) / SMART (4) --- MOVE SPEED (7.5) / MV (7.5) --- SMART (4) / MV (7.5)

ArchMage: MOVE SPEED (7.5) / BR (4) --- SMART (4) / BR (4)

Grand Wizard: MV (7.5) / BR (4)


PRIEST:

Templar: AC (7.5) / SMART (4) --- AC (7.5) / STRIKE (4) --- AC (7.5) / COUNTER (4)

Fallen: MOVE SPEED (7.5) / AC (7.5) --- MOVE SPEED (7.5) / WISE (4)

Avenger: MOVE SPEED (7.5) / SMART (4) --- MOVE SPEED (7.5) / WISE (4)

Saint: WISE (4) / SMART (4) --- WISE (4) / STRIKE (4) --- WISE (4) / COUNTER (4)

I talk about priest only,
I cannot see the difference between Fallen and Avenger.
Take the skins required into consideration as well please.
If priests are changed in this way, people will still go for Templar...
(The default setting of symbol matched the characteristic of effect with the class! Why dualing thief/archer can have a decreased MAGIC casting time?)

[ArabianArrow]

NICE! Looks cool and organized. Can't wait to read it tomorrow. I'm so sleepy my eyelids are rolling down now

[KINGNEWBIE]

maybe the archer SYMBOLS can go a bit more higher

[HolyHell]

i think it would be cool for each dual to have 2-3 different symbols that way not every same dual would be different but that might be too much
i like some of the symbols the way they were, most of them ideas are great

[tsleeaa]

i think it would be cool for each dual to have 2-3 different symbols that way not every same dual would be different but that might be too much
i like some of the symbols the way they were, most of them ideas are great

But Elmy overlook the default setting which matches the characteristic of classes with effect.

I have an idea suddenly, each class assigned with 3 combinations of symbols.
They can get one of them by CHANCE
add a Symbol Cancel Quest also so ppl can redo the symbol quest.
(still ppl will go for to BEST symbol....)

[Elmy]

I talk about priest only,
I cannot see the difference between Fallen and Avenger.
Take the skins required into consideration as well please.
If priests are changed in this way, people will still go for Templar...
(The default setting of symbol matched the characteristic of effect with the class! Why dualing thief/archer can have a decreased MAGIC casting time?)

I made the difference between the Priest ones for Fallen and Avenger be Fallen = AC, because a Thief is more defense oriented than an archer. The Avenger I went with smart, because I wanted another defensive type of symbol, and Smart made the most sense for archer. Wise I decided upon because archers and thieves are also speed-oriented classes, so Wise made the most sense in terms of usefulness of a symbol for the priest. Decreasing casting time (speed). I feel that Wise is also extremely under appreciated and underestimated. And tsleeaa, I welcome you to try and find one that is 'characteristic" to the dualing class while still being useful. I'm trying to make EVERY symbol good, to at least be worth considering. I made it as close as it could be without the symbol being something completely out of left field for that class.

I put forth several suggestions for most of then, so that they can be used to balance one another out. I do agree that Templar would probably still be chosen over the others, so, I've changed one of the Saint ones.

Regarding Cyc / DB, a lot of this would depend on which one of the suggestions put forward are picked, if any. I will think about that, and maybe add a CYC / DB tab next to each one.

[tsleeaa]

I talk about priest only,
I cannot see the difference between Fallen and Avenger.
Take the skins required into consideration as well please.
If priests are changed in this way, people will still go for Templar...
(The default setting of symbol matched the characteristic of effect with the class! Why dualing thief/archer can have a decreased MAGIC casting time?)

I made the difference between the Priest ones for Fallen and Avenger be Fallen = AC, because a Thief is more defense oriented than an archer. The Avenger I went with smart, because I wanted another defensive type of symbol, and Smart made the most sense for archer. Wise I decided upon because archers and thieves are also speed-oriented classes, so Wise made the most sense in terms of usefulness of a symbol for the priest. Decreasing casting time (speed). I feel that Wise is also extremely under appreciated and underestimated. And tsleeaa, I welcome you to try and find one that is 'characteristic" to the dualing class while still being useful. I'm trying to make EVERY symbol good, to at least be worth considering. I made it as close as it could be without the symbol being something completely out of left field for that class.

I put forth several suggestions for most of then, so that they can be used to balance one another out. I do agree that Templar would probably still be chosen over the others, so, I've changed one of the Saint ones.

Regarding Cyc / DB, a lot of this would depend on which one of the suggestions put forward are picked, if any. I will think about that, and maybe add a CYC / DB tab next to each one.

Off topic: Wise is underestimated in normal server only. AC is much more important, right? I have played high rate server before, all priests with Double G5 AC+Counter, Wise+Resist All, and Masking+Aid and so on. Wise is less important than Wise.......(and 1 G8 Legend Saint Cloack is more than enough)

(Kind reminder: people will complaint again if priest symbol is reinforced to a level exceed the currently strongest symbol: Templar)

[Elmy]

Off topic: Wise is underestimated in normal server only. AC is much more important, right? I have played high rate server before, all priests with Double G5 AC+Counter, Wise+Resist All, and Masking+Aid and so on. Wise is less important than Wise....

(Kind reminder: people will complaint again if priest symbol is reinforced to a level exceed the currently strongest symbol: Templar)

They won't complain if every other symbol is equally as good, or better.

That's the point of this.

Resist All is worthless to put on a Priest symbol - it's good for only one class (wiz, obviously), and Priests already eat wizards. Additionally, what kills Priests is BR, which ignores resistances. No one would waste a symbol slot on that. I don't want to put Evasion because I think that would be just too much anti-wiz.

Masking and Aid... I would still rate Wise, Strike, Counter, AC above them. I would put MOVE SPEED on equal terms with them. How about this... I'm gonna edit it just a bit again, check in 5 minutes.

[tsleeaa]

Off topic: Wise is underestimated in normal server only. AC is much more important, right? I have played high rate server before, all priests with Double G5 AC+Counter, Wise+Resist All, and Masking+Aid and so on. Wise is less important than Wise....

(Kind reminder: people will complaint again if priest symbol is reinforced to a level exceed the currently strongest symbol: Templar)

They won't complain if every other symbol is equally as good, or better.

That's the point of this.

Resist All is worthless to put on a Priest symbol - it's good for only one class (wiz, obviously), and Priests already eat wizards. Additionally, what kills Priests is BR, which ignores resistances. No one would waste a symbol slot on that. I don't want to put Evasion because I think that would be just too much anti-wiz.

Masking and Aid... I would still rate Wise, Strike, Counter, AC above them. I would put MOVE SPEED on equal terms with them. How about this... I'm gonna edit it just a bit again, check in 5 minutes.

......Example only not suggestion! Off topic already mentioned.....
My suggestion is that
Assign each class with 3 different combination of symbol effect
So players will receive one of them RANDOMLY
Add a symbol cancel quest also
So players can redo the symbol quest.
(Masking + Aid is made into a sword which can be unequipped after casted all protection and aid magic, just an example, dont be serious, to prove my point that Wise is not generally underestimated, but it is in normal server cuz u dont have Double Grade rare so easily, need to decide, so AC will be more important, and this create an illusion that Wise is underestimated)